Gibson les paul by serial number

The serial number for my guitar starts with 2 letters (CS) followed by 6 digits. Btoth76, I had a look at the white Gibson sticker on top of the cardboard box that the guitar was packed in, and whilst there's nothing specifically saying that this is the model number, I've found what I'm presuming is the model number.

Gibson les paul by serial number. All Gibson Les Paul Listings. Gibson USA Les Paul Standard 50s Heritage Cherry Sunburst [SN 211520093] (05/02) Used - Very Good. $2,235.54. $2,235.54. Gibson Les Paul Studio w/ Gator GB (2013 - Sunburst) Used - Excellent. $1,150. $1,150.

I recently got a Les Paul that was stamped 12/23/2009 but finished at the end of January 2010 per the QC checklist. The serial number is just when the neck was made. qwank ... Unusual Gibson serial number. Liamoguitar72; Oct 29, 2012; Gibson Les Pauls; 2. Replies 33 Views 8K. Feb 1, 2021. serial numbers. FLICKOFLASH; Jul 31, 2007; Gibson Les ...

Nov 10, 2023 · Many people have asked me how to interpret the serial number on their Gibson guitar. I thought I'd make a stand alone video about this, given that it's somet... So I've just done a quick search I found two Less+ guitars for sale. One in Germany offered at £1,215 (£1,236 shipped) and another in Poland at £1,237 (£1,313 shipped). The cost new was £1,500. If those are going to sell at or close to those prices then they've held value pretty well.Gibson Les Paul Goldtop Serial Numbers. Gibson's serial number scheme for solid body guitars in the 1950s usually pretty easy to decode. Vic Dapra's book indicates that the very earliest Gibson Les Paul goldtops in 1952 didn't have serial numbers, but starting in 1953, the serial numbers were ink stamped on the backs of the headstocks with a ...3. Posted July 3, 2014. i've seen two custom shop les pauls with the exact same serial number. i thought they were both fake until i contacted gibson and found "that doesn't mean we stamped 824 guitars in one day, it means that was number 824 in the production sequence."Gibson USA ; Help identifying this les paul ! Help identifying this les paul ! By Temoc612 November 24, 2017 in Gibson USA. Share More sharing options... Followers 0. Reply to this topic; Start new topic; Recommended Posts. ... That serial number has been on many fake Gibsons. My guess is that this guitar is a copy.Nov 15, 2023 ... Seriously though, check out the full video on my channel because it is so much more than this. Like and subbb.Les Paul Classic 1989-2014: This model features an ink stamped serial number with no "MADE IN USA" (just as we used on the original 1952-1960 Les Pauls). Most will be 5 to 6 digits in length, but the earliest examples feature 4 digit serial numbers.

The Following Text is From Gibson: In the summer of 1968, Gibson did something unprecedented. They re-released two guitar models that were discontinued a decade earlier, a Les Paul Custom and a Les Paul Goldtop. Many famous guitarists at the time adopted 1950s Les Paul models because of their heavy tones, vocal qualities and endless sustain ...Tone Report. The Reverb Gear Dating Hub. Published February 14, 2022 by Peter Schu. Gear History. Say you want to know the value of a certain vintage Fender Stratocaster, a Keystone-badge Ludwig drum kit, or a Martin that may or may not be pre-War. Our gear dating guides below can help you determine the exact model and year.Serial Number. Body Binding. Stoptail Position. Electronics and Wiring Harness. Price and Seller Reputation. Final Thoughts On How To Spot A Fake Gibson …Learn how to verify the authenticity of your Gibson serial number with this easy guide. Find out the year and model of your instrument.Nov 10, 2023 · Many people have asked me how to interpret the serial number on their Gibson guitar. I thought I'd make a stand alone video about this, given that it's somet... Instrument ID and information. Identifying 2006 Gibson Les Paul Custom. G'day Everyone, I recently purchased a Gibson Les Paul Custom 1968 re-issue Guitar. Being new to the Gibson Brand I have tried unsuccessfully to gain positive information on this guitar's serial no anywhere. What I have found is that it may have been a limited series made ... Date of Construction: Around September 1968 through about late April 1969. My Custom has a high serial for this range (559xxx) that is confirmed with Gibson to have shipped in early April 1969. A high 530,xxx number, an LP Standard, is the first 1969 serial number according to an excellent source. A 3pc necked, 565xxx shipped around May 19th ... 6. Author. Posted October 9, 2016. I received a reply at 5:00am this morning which was surprising. You are all correct. They have stopped giving serial number by day and year and it is now just the order of ALL Gibsons made. So, my '16 Trad with a Serial Number of 160001864 was the 1864 Gibson made in 2016.

The new Les Paul™ Standard returns to the classic design that made it relevant, played, and loved - shaping sound across generations and genres of music. It pays tribute to Gibson's Golden Era of innovation and brings authenticity back to life. The Les Paul Standard '60s has a solid mahogany body with an AA figured maple top and a SlimTaper™ 60s-style mahogany neck with a rosewood ...Just got my first Gibson a Les Paul standard from Guitar Center. I get home and try to verify info by serial number and comes up unidentified on every Gibson serial look up I can find. serial number is 122990201 also made in usa lettering seems kinda shallow and does not say the year under it lik...Real-time updated price guide for Gibson Les Paul electric guitars, covering multiple vendors, lots of Les Paul versions, and more.Les Paul Models SG Models ES-Style Models Basses Designer Models. Acoustic Guitars. Gibson Acoustic. Original Collection Modern Collection. ... Product Registration Customer Service Repair and Restoration Report Counterfeits Serial Number FAQ Gibson Guitar Specs (2015-2019) Dealer Resource Center;

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Laaz. Members. 1.4k. Posted July 16, 2010. I'm calling it a fake. With the metric bridge & the font size of the serial #. They didn't use that large font serial until the 2000 models. Do a Ebay search for 1981 Les Paul. Not a single one has that large font.I have a serial number that was written on the original purchase receipt: 9111868. According to www.guitardaterproject.org it was made in Korea in 1989 (I assume at Sammick). I am concerned whether this is an authentic Epiphone Les Paul or possibly a counterfeit. The guitar is completely original bought new off the showroom.Hello, i have a Gibson Les Paul but i don't know if its deluxe or junior or what! jajaja Can i have any help please! the serial number is 0 0 3 1 5 6 2 6, according to the explications in the Gibson page, the guitar was made in Jan 31, 1905 i dont know if that interpretation its true. Helps me pl...Your guitar was made at the Nashville Plant, TN, USA April 29th, 1999 Production Number: 234 The Guitar Dater Project - Determine the date of your guitar by its serial number

All Gibson Les Paul Listings. Gibson USA Les Paul Standard 50s Heritage Cherry Sunburst [SN 211520093] (05/02) Used - Very Good. $2,235.54. $2,235.54. Gibson Les Paul Studio w/ Gator GB (2013 - Sunburst) Used - Excellent. $1,150. $1,150.Gibson Les Paul Standard 1952 - 1957; Gretsch Model Numbers and Name; Gibson Factory Order Numbers; Fender Neck and Body Dates; ... In 1970, Gibson started stamping "Made In U.S.A" on the back of headstock, below the six digit serial number. This is a quick way to tell if you have a post 69 Gibson. If so, the above dating chart does not ...Product Registration Customer Service Repair and Restoration Report Counterfeits Serial Number FAQ Gibson Guitar Specs (2015-2019) ... Les Paul Custom Serial Number - 1996 Les Paul Custom Serial Number - 1996. By keoghpt74 March 24, 2015 in Instrument ID and information. Start new topic;A Gibson Les Paul should have a nice clean route, clean solder joints, and well-organized wiring. Some Gibsons will have push/pull connectors and printed circuit boards (PCB). Some will have a metal plate that the pots are attached to, and the Custom shop reissues will just be 4 pots, a jack, a ground wire, and an extremely neat wiring job.Note: The discontinued Gibson USA Jimmy Page Signature Les Paul has a standard 8 digit serial number. Joe Perry Les Paul (2 models) – Joe Perry Signature Les Paul from 1996 (trans black finish) – numbered in sequence as “JPxxx” – Boneyard LP – Pilot Run models have an inked number and hand written “Pilot Run”.Whether you want to verify an old Les Paul or vintage L-5, maybe a Gibson SG, Firebird, Explorer, Flying V, Hummingbird, The Paul, or any other model, our database uncovers …For non-Japanese Epiphone, the prefix "F" would indicate Fine Guitars (Korea). However, I was under the impression that Epiphone stopped producing guitars in Korea in 2007-2008 and that production was only in China and Indonesia with the exception of the remaining Elitist models from Japan.Shop Les Paul Electric Guitars at Gibson. From the classic Les Paul Standard to the new Les Paul Studio, we've got a guitar for you.Yeah your are right chappers the run started 140001, I just got a gibson 2014 special and emailed gibson my serial number to find out, tech replied my guitar was the 12,304th gibson guitar built at the Nashville plant for the year off my serial number, no code like in the past, just their 120 year anniversary 2014 models built by gibson usa and ...

LocationLondon, U.K. Posted November 23, 2012. LPBGLDB1 means Les Paul BFG in Trans-Black finish. 012070399 (as you've already established) means April 30 2007 so that would tie-in with the BFG production period. Simple answer is either the paperwork has ended up in the wrong case or it's the wrong case for the R-I.

According to one info site: Gibson Serial Numbers, 1975-1977. All models, decal, 2 digit prefix followed by 6 digits. The decal can also state the model name/number.608. As for factory seconds, the best playing Les Paul I've ever owned was a 1978 Deluxe stamped "second". Paid $200 for it. Never should have sold that one. When I traded it (to Dave's Guitar Shop), I was treated very fairly and Dave didn't devalue it because it was a second.Serial Number Ink Stamp for 1950s (1953-1961) Gibson. If you plan to add lacquer on top of your ink number, practice that on scrap wood too. The acrylic stamping block shown in the photos is for example and is not included. ... Epiphone By Gibson Gibson Les Paul Electric Guitars, Gibson Solid Gibson Les Paul Electric Guitars, Gibson Les Paul ...More specifically but not clearly stated by Gibson, those were "Custom Shop Series" models made in Memphis. The serial number question is an entirely different situation. Most of the reissues came with 5 digit serial numbers. And some of the higher end models like the '59 reissues came with an "A" prefix.How do I check a Gibson serial number? The easiest way to check Gibson serial numbers is to do so against the already established data that Gibson has so kindly included on their website. Once you have found the serial number on the back of the headstock, then you can use this to find out the history of your particular guitar, where it was ...Gibson used 5 or 6 digit ink stamped serial numbers on Les Paul guitars from 1952 until 1960. The first digit of this style serial number indicates the last digit of the year it was manufactured. For example, this Les Paul's serial number is "7_6227" so it was made in 1957. This is how to date a Gibson Les Paul serial number from the 1950s.Dec 30, 2017 ... The ranking number may consist of any number ... serial number system used by Epiphone has not yet been completely deciphered. ... Gibson Les Paul ...I doubt that anyone actually has the first ever guitar that Gibson released. The original Gibson Les Paul, however, has been sold for just shy of a million dollars which, considering its veritable legacy in the annals of popular music and rock and roll history, just about shakes out.Left: The "inked on" serial number on a 1955 Les Paul standard solidbody guitar. This style serial number was used on all 1953 to 1960 solidbody Gibson guitars. ... Right: 1977 Gibson decal serial number applied on a Les Paul Artisan. Gibson Serial Numbers, 1975-1977. All models, decal, 2 digit prefix followed by 6 digits. The decal can also ...This early 1960 Gibson Les Paul Standard is very well preserved inside its original case with all the hang tags. Its serial number is in the 0_2000s range which generally has 1959 features except for the neck profile. The neck profile measurement of this Les Paul is 0.80" deep at the first fret and 0.90" deep at the 12th fret.

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All Access. 1. Posted December 6, 2010. Hello. i am wondering what year is my gibson les paul custom (black). The serial number is CS41222 i cant seem to find out because most of the research i did all gibson has 8 digits? i bought this guitar from Sam ash new york about 5 or 6 years ago. thank you.Laaz. Members. 1.4k. Posted July 16, 2010. I'm calling it a fake. With the metric bridge & the font size of the serial #. They didn't use that large font serial until the 2000 models. Do a Ebay search for 1981 Les Paul. Not a single one has that large font.Hy everyone, this serial number CS 10427 of a Les Paul Custom wich year of production does it belongs to? Thanks. Jump to content. main. Electric Guitars. ... Serial number Gibson Les Paul Custom. By Mr Marky August 5, 2020 in Gibson Custom. Share More sharing options... Followers 0. Reply to this topic;Congrats on your new guitar!! The serial number is consistent with a 2011 Custom Shop 1959 Les Paul VOS Reissue in Sunset Tea Burst finish. Unfortunately, this serial number scheme does not indicate the specific date of manufacture. However, our records show that this was shipped from the factory on 11/30/2011. This would have a 1 piece ...This is how to date a Gibson Les Paul guitars number from the s. Gibson reused this serial tell scheme for reissue guitars in the past 20 years as well, so check to guitars that the style matches. Do you have a Gibson Les Paul with an ink stamped serial number? I vintage looking to buy Gibson Les Pauls with ink stamped serial numbers like this ...Follow me on social media:Facebookhttps://www.facebook.com/kozumaheiji Instagramhttps://instagram.com/KozumaHeiji Twitterhttps://twitter.com/KozumaHeiji If y... continued to use the 6 digit serial numbers through 1978 and 1979. So double check the serial numbers on those 1970s L-5s, Super 400s, and Super 5 BJBs! Gibson's F O N System In addition to the above serial number information, Gibson also used Factory Order Numbers (F O N) to track batches of instruments being produced at the time. Though this 1956 Les Paul sports the black lacquer finish of Gibson's Les Paul Custom, serial number 65398 is actually a goldtop in disguise. When Gibson teamed up with renowned recording star Les Paul in 1952, the company created a guitar that became one of the most influential and popular instruments of all time: The Les Paul Model. ….

Gibson USA. Dating a Les Paul Classic - 5 digit serial number. Hi! A friend of mine is willing to sell me his very pretty les paul classic which he believes to be from the 90s. I'm not so sure. It has a 5 digit serial number which reads: 5 9669, and a "custom shop" stamp on the back of the headstock. Does anyone have any idea what year this is ...Hello, I have a Les Paul Classic 1960 re-issue and I cannot find a serial number anywhere. I'm pretty certain that it's a genuine Gibson. ... The Gibson Lounge ; Serial Number absent Serial Number absent. By Richard 2208 October 10, 2021 in The Gibson Lounge. Share More sharing options... Followers 0. Reply to this topic;3. Posted November 21, 2009. This white bodied Les Paul's headstock back is stamped 'Made in USA' with serial number. 017160526, but it was said to have been bought in Korea, in an Epiphone packing carton.Product Registration Customer Service Repair and Restoration Report Counterfeits Serial Number FAQ Gibson Guitar Specs (2015-2019) Dealer Resource Center Locate AThe 1st digit indicates the year of manufacture for the 4 & 5 digit serial numbers, these were used from 1989-1999. The 1st and 2nd indicate the year of manufacture for the 6 digit serial numbers which we've been using since 2000. Examples -. 9 xxx = 1989 (4 digit number beginning with "9" used only in 1989)Gibson Les Paul Customshop DC. Serial number. Which year? By Kimakerholdt84 December 2, 2023 in Gibson Custom. Share More sharing options... Followers 0. Reply to this topic; Start new topic; Recommended Posts. Kimakerholdt84. Posted December 2, 2023. Kimakerholdt84. Members; 4GIBSON SERIAL NUMBERS: 0.35 Acoustic / 1.10 Quality Check List (White Paper) / 1.46 2019 Serial-Number - if the last number is a 3 = special run / 2.15 HOW T...All Access. 1. Posted December 6, 2010. Hello. i am wondering what year is my gibson les paul custom (black). The serial number is CS41222 i cant seem to find out because most of the research i did all gibson has 8 digits? i bought this guitar from Sam ash new york about 5 or 6 years ago. thank you.On 2/28/2021 at 4:45 PM, Daz-lp13 said: Hi guys, I am a very proud owner of a 2019 les paul custom in gloss ebony. It is actually the one on the official website and other websites that use gibson stock photos. Its serial number is CS 900011. my question is how the serial number works. Gibson les paul by serial number, The numbers appear as the 5th and 6th digits in the serial number. This information has not been officially confirmed by Epiphone. F-Serial Numbers on Les Paul Standard '59/'60 Models and Tribute/Plus Models The latest serial number system used by Epiphone has not yet been completely deciphered. The new "F" models are made in China., All Access. 1. Posted December 6, 2010. Hello. i am wondering what year is my gibson les paul custom (black). The serial number is CS41222 i cant seem to find out because most of the research i did all gibson has 8 digits? i bought this guitar from Sam ash new york about 5 or 6 years ago. thank you., Certain guitar models built in the late 1970s can be used to demonstrate the old-style, six-digit serial num-bers. It is estimated that Gibson’s Kalamazoo plant continued to use the six-digit serial numbers through 1978 and 1979. So double check the serial numbers on those 1970s L-5s, Super 400s, and Super 5. BJBs!, Gibson Brands. Gibson USA. Faint Serial number and writing on back of headstock. Hi, I have just received my SG standard by courier and I am concerned that I can hardly make out the serial number or "Made in USA" on the back of the headstock. It an ebony one so the stamp is painted over as opposed to varnished in the Cherry version., In today’s fast-paced world, businesses and consumers alike rely heavily on technology. From smartphones to appliances, almost everything we use has a unique identification code kn..., Les Paul, now a successful radio and TV star suggested to Gibson president (Ted McCarthy) should look into investing in the popular Epiphone upright bass division. Gibson’s own upright bass branch had not been picked up since the end of the war (1945). ... Gibson Serial Number Lookup;, Tone Report. The Reverb Gear Dating Hub. Published February 14, 2022 by Peter Schu. Gear History. Say you want to know the value of a certain vintage Fender Stratocaster, a Keystone-badge Ludwig drum kit, or a Martin that may or may not be pre-War. Our gear dating guides below can help you determine the exact model and year., It’s simple enough with our Guitar Serial Number Lookup Decoders. Type your serial numbers into our database below, and you’ll get all the information the internet has on the instrument. At present we have updated serial number decoder for: Epiphone Serial Numbers. Gibson Serial Number Lookup. Fender Serial Numbers., For your consideration, Garrett Park Guitars presents this 1994 Gibson Custom Shop "Macallister" Historic Les Paul. This mind-blowing example is from one of the earliest …, "Les Paul Classic: The Les Paul Classic features a five- or six-digit. number like the models had in the late 1950s and early 1960s. The. serial number works just like it did back then with the first number. indicating the last number in the year of production. The following. four or five digits are production rank and if there is only four digits, X=> . 0=Nashville . 5=Memphis. Gibson is notoriously slow at update the info on their website. CS 104260. The first digit in the serial is the last digit of the year of manufacture - a 1 so probably 2011. The second digit is 0 which means the guitar was built/finished in Nashville., Gibson USA. Dating a Les Paul Classic - 5 digit serial number. Hi! A friend of mine is willing to sell me his very pretty les paul classic which he believes to be from the 90s. I'm not so sure. It has a 5 digit serial number which reads: 5 9669, and a "custom shop" stamp on the back of the headstock. Does anyone have any idea what year this is ..., So I've just done a quick search I found two Less+ guitars for sale. One in Germany offered at £1,215 (£1,236 shipped) and another in Poland at £1,237 (£1,313 shipped). The cost new was £1,500. If those are going to sell at or close to those prices then they've held value pretty well., The most important dating feature on guitars with six-digit serial numbers is that, starting in 1970, Gibson began stamping "Made In USA" near the serial number on the back of the headstock. Since the value of a Gibson Les Paul differs widely between 1970 and 1975, it is very important to pinpoint the year. As for dating pots, you are ..., Early Gibson solidbody electrics received a serial stamp on the back of the headstock, with the first number indicating the year of production. The serial number on this Les Paul Junior indicates that it was made in 1956. 1961-1969. Starting in 1961, Gibson implemented a new serialization system designed to cover its entire lineup., It is a replica made by Kris Derrig of MusicWorks, a guitar store located in Redondo Beach, California. The top, like those of the most sought-after original Les Pauls, features highly figured book-matched maple, but with no cherry tint around the edges of the top. The serial number is ink-stamped in the style of a 1959 Gibson, but the neck ..., 1 code: In 1985 Gibson stopped labeling seconds, but many model numbers still end in 1. It appears that Gibson acoustic reassigned the number for the hand - 1=RH, 2=LH, and 3=RH with pick up, and 4=LH with pick up. Sometime after 2014 Gibson Acoustic began to drop the ending digit from model numbers and designate left handed guitars by …, Check out Les Paul Serial Number Lookup. Gibson Les Paul Standard 1960. The Gibson Les Paul Standard 1960 was made during the tail end of the three year production run of the version of the Les Paul we call The Burst. The Les Paul Model was introduced in 1952 with the gold finished top that led to nickname "Goldtop" ..., Thank you to all who posted links to Brazilian fingerboards. I an confused about one aspect. I own a 2003 57 RI Black Beauty with a VERY low serial number. It was my understanding that all customs had Ebony fingerboards but the Gibson website claims some Customs did have Brazilian that year. The link to Guitarpool claims mine IS Brazilian., If the week was, for example, 45 the pot may not have been installed into a guitar until 1971. At any rate, as you mentioned, the earliest year would be 1970. Another factor is the "Les Paul" signature and "Model" inscription on the headstock - in mid-1972 that inscription was changed from a silkscreen to a decal., The 1st digit indicates the year of manufacture for the 4 & 5 digit serial numbers, these were used from 1989-1999. The 1st and 2nd indicate the year of manufacture for the 6 digit serial numbers which we've been using since 2000. Examples -. 9 xxx = 1989 (4 digit number beginning with "9" used only in 1989) 0 xxxx = 1990., Probably the Stratocaster (Most famosuly made by Fender, or Squire, Fender's sister company), Les Paul (Gibson or Epiphone) and an SG (Gibson or Epiphone). Apart from these, classic flying V's ..., Product Registration Customer Service Repair and Restoration Report Counterfeits Serial Number FAQ Gibson Guitar Specs (2015-2019) ... A cheap Les Paul copy (an Aria or Del Toro or some other such brand) that somebody applied a Gibson logo to years ago ... Serial Number FAQ; Store Policies & FAQ; Gibson Guitar Specs (2015-2019) Dealer Resources., The headstock on top says Gibson. Under that between the tuners for the 2 and 4 strings it says Custom Shop. Between the Custom and Shop. it says in script Les Paul. At the top of the neck , after the nut, a golden metal plate says in script Les Paul. The serial number is 02005514., A conversation with Paul Bernard, the director of Alexa Fund, about Amazon's investment strategy during harsh economic headwinds. Amazon made headlines this month when the company ..., 15.7k. LocationLondon, U.K. Posted September 14, 2023 (edited) Yes the LPS+ means Les Paul Standard Plus with the plus meaning AAA flamed top. I think the other letters describe the finish (i.e vintage sunburst) but cant quite make it out. Year is the first digit and 5th digit (04 for 2004) of the serial number., Hello I have a Les Paul with a serial # which I cannot seem to find. It seems stamped in ink on the back of the Headstock with the Made in USA . . . This is a 6 digit and I understand from the website most are 8 digit. ... Product Registration Customer Service Repair and Restoration Report Counterfeits Serial Number FAQ Gibson Guitar Specs ..., Custom Admin. Members. 981. Posted January 29, 2008. that number brings up 2 guitars in my system: an r9 in heritage darkburst finish from 2/1997, and a VOS r9 in washed cherry finish from 1/2007. Quote., Whereas Martin guitars have been using a single, consistent numbering system since the 19th century, Gibson has used several different serial number formats …, Hello, I have a Les Paul Classic 1960 re-issue and I cannot find a serial number anywhere. I'm pretty certain that it's a genuine Gibson. ... The Gibson Lounge ; Serial Number absent Serial Number absent. By Richard 2208 October 10, 2021 in The Gibson Lounge. Share More sharing options... Followers 0. Reply to this topic;, Probably: This section is intended to be a quick and dirty guide to ID'ing whether a guitar is a Late Sixties Les Paul (LSLP) using its serial number. If it is an LSLP, within thirty …, Gibson Custom Shop is the pinnacle of craftsmanship, quality, and sound excellence. Each instrument celebrates Gibson's legacy through accuracy, authenticity and attention to detail.The Joe Perry "Gold Rush" Les Paul Axcess model is the result of years of creative collaboration between Joe and Gibson. It represents his idealized vision of a Les Paul model with a vibe, sound and feel that is ..., My one is a 2005 Gibson Les Paul '57 with a 1957 serial number and has R7 stamped into the pots cavity. I bought mine because I grew up a Guns N' Roses fan and loved guitar and I knew before I knew who Gibson were, that Slash's pickups were why his guitar sounded so great. I was a lad starting in secondary school thinking about those …